Door mirror dip issue

4064 Views 14 Replies 6 Participants Last post by frankc, Nov 10, 2014

segillum

Discussion Starter · May 22, 2012

Firstly, apologies if this particular issue has already been discussed somewhere on the forum. I've searched carefully for it but found no reference.

I have a 53-plate car which amongst other things has the 'driving position memory system'. In the course of an overhaul last year the vehicle was retrofitted with power-fold electrochromic door mirrors and I had thought the door mirror dipping function would also become available. According to the manual this dips the passenger side mirror by 7 degrees when reversing, to give a better view of the kerb or whatever.

The very competent independent who did the retrofit reported that the car would not accept this function being programmed via WDS. I recently had occasion to discuss the issue with the local dealer, with whom I have a good relationship. They had a quick look with the newer diagnostic systems and also couldn't find a way to programme it, so they asked Jaguar. Predictably they got short shrift ("We do not support modifications which depart from the original build specification").

Does anyone know how -- or whether -- this can be done, or is something like a BPM firmware upgrade required?

Many thanks in advance.

John

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astromorg

· #2 · May 22, 2012

It sounds as though you might be expecting the mirror dip to be automatic, but it's not quite. With reverse selected and the passenger side mirror selected at the joystick switch, you have to briefly pull the joystick back when the mirror will dip 7 degrees. A further pull will dip it by another 7. Changing out of reverse will trigger the mirror to return to normal. Does that work?

It's quite difficult - well for me anyway! - to be sure of which module is doing what! The mirrors are powered from the driver's and passenger door modules, but they also get 'information' from the BPM, using SCP (Standard Corporate Protocol) and CAN (Controller Area Network), via the Instrument Cluster - principally vehicle speed and Reverse selection. So you could well be right in thinking that a BPM update is required to pass on the 'Reverse selected' info to the door module. But it could also be that the BPM is doing the right thing but the door module doesn't 'understand' and needs upgrading.(All relevant wiring diagrams show the Instrument Cluster putting 'Reverse' into the CAN when dealing with mirror movement) Although JTIS mentions that the Serial Data Link is used for the programming of certain control modules, it doesn't say anymore! To be pessimistic, both modules possibly require re programming - or replacing!I'm not aware of any DIY module reprogramming experience!

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segillum

Discussion Starter · #3 · May 23, 2012

>It sounds as though you might be expecting the mirror dip to be automatic, but it's not quite. With reverse selected and the passenger side mirror selected at the joystick switch, you have to briefly pull the joystick back when the mirror will dip 7 degrees. A further pull will dip it by another 7. Changing out of reverse will trigger the mirror to return to normal. Does that work?<

Well -- funny old thing but it does now! I'm familiar with the way the function is supposed to work and it definitely wasn't working at all. But for some reason or other, disconnecting the battery and waiting for the statutory 10min or so seems suddenly to have provoked the various elements of the system into proper communication and it's now doing precisely what the manual says it should do.

>It's quite difficult - well for me anyway! - to be sure of which module is doing what...<...SNIP...>... !I'm not aware of any DIY module reprogramming experience!<

The modern way with networks and busses and whatnot sometimes strikes me as a phenomenally complicated way of achieving a simple end but no doubt the Great Brains at Browns Lane had their reasons.

Anyway, it's working now and thank you very much for your input.

John

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astromorg

· #4 · May 23, 2012

Just contacting this forum sometimes frightens the electronics into submission! Glad you've got it sorted!

segillum

Discussion Starter · #5 · May 23, 2012

>Just contacting this forum sometimes frightens the electronics into submission!<

Hmm. Before a firmware update solved the problem, it was agreed in the family that the car's name was Lurch. But I've always suspected that he's really Hal...

John

Paulj6152

· #6 · May 25, 2012

I thought I would check my mirrors for dipping on reversing and my passenger side works fine dipping when press button , however drivers side doesn't work at all.

The odd thing is the passenger one works regardless whether you have selected the left or right mirror . All other function like memory and retracting work fine.

Just wondering if anybody has any ideas.

scm

· #7 · May 25, 2012

Yep, working as designed. It surprised me a bit at first, but I find my view down onto the closer driver's side mirror gives me enough downward view without needing to dip it.

Paulj6152

· #8 · May 26, 2012

Thanks SCM sounds odd but survived up till now not using it, so not a big issue

segillum

Discussion Starter · #9 · May 27, 2012

Paulj6152 said:
Thanks SCM sounds odd but survived up till now not using it, so not a big issue

The write-up in the manual for my 2003 car only talks about the passengers' side mirror having this function. Maybe it's different for other model years?

scm

· #10 · May 29, 2012

Mine's a 2004.5 MY.

frankc

· #11 · Nov 10, 2014

Just came across this topic by accident whilst looking for something else. I have powerfold mirrors installed from the factory. That function works fine. But there is no Auto dipping or undipping. Having read the above postings I went out. Put the mirror selector into the left position. Selected reverse. Nothing happened. So I flicked the switch backwards, it moved but only as long as I was holding the button backwards. Short/quick flips do not make the mirror continue downwards after releasing the button. I have the mirror pointing downwards but it does not return to 'normal' after I take the car out of reverse.

I was also wondering if the mirror is part of the memory package too? Say I get everything setup seat, mirrors etc then put it in memory. Then move the mirror, seats to another position. When I push the memory button the seats will move back to the right position but the mirrors stay still. Should they move too?

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astromorg

· #12 · Nov 10, 2014

Yes, the mirrors should adjust between memory settings 1 and 2 - assuming they've been set to different positions for each memory button.

You appear to have a fault with your reverse dip. You were operating it correctly! Try it with the selector in the righthand position; the left mirror should still dip! I wish it was otherwise, but it seems not!

I would start by checking the connections to the mirrors, the two door modules and the two seat modules.

frankc

· #13 · Nov 10, 2014

No it doesn't unfortunately. I also noticed that if I alter the right hand mirror then push the memory button it will restore itself to the original memory position but the left will not.

I think the thing to try will be disconnecting the battery and then touching the neg to the pos then see if it works.

Thanks for the reply.

carlosfernandez

· #14 · Nov 10, 2014

Check the switch / joystick - mine didn't work in a couple of directions backwards being one so no dipping.

Removed the joystick switch panel, stripped down and cleaned electrical contacts inside = all perfect now - full control in all directions + dip

frankc

· #15 · Nov 10, 2014

carlosfernandez said:
Check the switch / joystick - mine didn't work in a couple of directions backwards being one so no dipping.

Removed the joystick switch panel, stripped down and cleaned electrical contacts inside = all perfect now - full control in all directions + dip

Thanks for the suggestion. But I know the backwards control works. If I have the switch in the middle then quickly pull back and let go the power mirrors fold in. I found out this when I was reversing into a very tight spot with a line of cars waiting to get pass in front of me. I flipped the button and both mirrors folded in. Could I work out how to get them out again?? Reversing backwards with no side mirrors in a tight spot can get 'interesting'.

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