Ingenium Timing chain issues.

MrKis said:

Apologies Richard, I should have been a bit more diplomatic in my response. There isn't one single issue with the AJ200d engine, it seems that the failures resulting in the engine becoming out of time, have different sources. Grouped together as timing setup issues, they are mostly repairable. Obviously carnage can still happen.

There are two people in this thread that had failures in the timing chain setup and subsequent repairs.

XF R-Sport Auto Timing Chain

Hi Guys First post so please be kind. I have just been advised that my 2018 XF 2.0 Diesel needs a new Timing Chain because its rattling. It went in because there was a horrendous knocking noise from bottom left of the engine area. Which caused a heavy vibration through the car. The garage...

www.jaguarforum.com

Here's another;

P0341 FAULT CODE ON MY XE PRESTIGE 2.0D 180PS

Hi All Over the weekend I had the EML light come on and the car became sluggish (as I know it would) so I called the RAC. The patrol arrived and quickly plugged in to find the fault code P0341 (Cam sensor fault) so I purchased an OE one from Jaguar (LR074065) and the RAC fitted yesterday but...

www.jaguarforum.com

Alansking talked about rebuilding them following timing setup failures.

Weird "rattle" noise when the engine is cold?

Hello together! First things first: thank all of you for this awesome forum! I already found some very helpfull hints for my car and its nice to see some other beatiful Jags in here! :) I bought a XE 2.0 Diesel R-Sport about 4 weeks ago from 2015 with only 40k kms on it and im absolutely in...

www.jaguarforum.com

Here's the video of an Ingenium engined evoque with a timing setup failure that was fixed in a workshop full of cars with similar problems, all being fixed.

Engine Oil Critically Low and then engine would not start

2016 MY 65 reg XF Rsport 2.0D automatic - Today whilst driving on M40 Engine Oil Critically Low message suddenly appeared and within seconds my gas pedal stopped responding. Car was slowing down, I had managed to get to stop on hard shoulder, unable to use knob to go to parking or neutral. I...

www.jaguarforum.com

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Hi MrKis,

No apology needed!

Thanks for the links, most of which I recall reading at the time.

And what ever happened to @Alansking ?

In all these links, these engines were still running when they were diagnosed and as such, repairs were fairly straightforward, if costly!

As soon as the combination of chain, tensioner and guide wear conspire to cause the engine to stop, repair becomes at best uneconomical due to the damage that appears to be inflicted on valve gear, at least from what I've seen.

It remains however, a very disappointing situation and all we as owners can do is to follow best practice regarding maintenance and use of our cars and be vigilant in listening for untoward noises emanating from the engine. Oh, and keep our collective fingers crossed!

JLR know of the timing chain issues, and pre-lockdown my local dealer said they probably would have replaced the engine, or paid a vast chunk which would have been acceptable. He said due to the financial hit everyone suffered they were cutting their losses by being a lot tighter with warranty, or design issues. Any little thing, and they would back away. I went all the way up to JLR Head Office with my grievance, and the two issues for not offering any help:
1. I did not buy the car from a Jaguar Dealer - which is a load of bollocks, you can buy a car from whom you want.
2. One service had been a 1,000 miles late, before my ownership, though a Jaguar (Franchise/Dealer) had always serviced it. Knowing what we know now, that is about their only escape clause. Though I think as we can all agree the service intervals recommended on all models are too few and far between. My XF is recommended at 16K, but it gets done at 8 - 10K without fail.

The main issue as Rich has stated is that most of the parts that were wrecked in my engine were not available. I had it with a young guy who picked up the work from a dodgy engine repair company as I stuck the middle finger up at JLR. He found that you could get gaskets, the timing chain kit, and filters. He could not get valves, pistons, or even rings. As Rich mentioned Alansking on here had to modify what he could get his hands on, as he had to repair a fair number of these engines with the same fault, again proving mine was not isolated. All Jaguar could offer was a full bottom end, at more than the price I paid for a bare low mileage second hand engine. So that is the route I took, then got shot of the car within a few months of the repair.

@TheBoy - Like you, no offense intended with regards to the MGF. Yes they are a poor design with regards to the cooling system, and everyone knows of the issue. My son has just bought his first car, which is a TF. We believe the HG has been done (it states it has in the history), but if not, the price of repair is peanuts compared to some repairs on more modern vehicles. As I said I have had 3 of the things, and never had a major failure though driven thousands of miles in them. I trust them way more than anything else I have driven, other than the X-Type I had. I even trust my Trophy over my XF. The XF have crank-shaft issues if not serviced properly, and I have been told this by a well known, and liked Jag independent. I actually asked him which in his eyes are currently the most reliable Jaguars, and mine is one of them, and this is when the crank shaft issue was mentioned. He also mentioned that the XE Diesel Ingenium engine is the worst, and they have cars there waiting for engines.

If I had one now, and knew what I know now, it would be sitting waiting for a Timing Chain to be upgraded, and service intervals would be 8K maximum.

Yes I have bitched about my experience because in total I lost £8K due to my damn XE, but since then I have come across others who have lost over £10K, and the worst £13K. That was on an XF the same as mine, crankshaft failure, though they were short journey mongers so probably had caused a lot more issues.

MrKis said:

I’m not sure exactly what your symptoms are and what is broken but €6k+ sounds expensive.
Some members have had broken timing setup issues repaired for around £2k with updated parts to prevent future issues.

DPFs can usually be cleaned.

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The symptoms are that the engine vibrates a bit more. No red lights or indicators in the dashboard whatsoever. 110.000 km, 4 yrs. This is not a quiet engine but clearly vibrates more than when new.

Official Jaguar Dealer says that sometimes the DPFs oxidizes inside and that is the reason that cannot be regenerated. I do not know if they have physically tried to clean it. They also say that timing chain/ silent block/ DPF problem is correlated.

To me the issue is (as a Jaguar owner since 15 years ago) that today you cannot maintain this cars for a reasonable price. There is clearly an issue with 2.0 diesels and timing chains that generates more failures (EGRs, DPFs, turbo, ...) and Jaguar does not care about it. They should launch campaigns to repair them at discounted prices. You cannot force your customers to fire sell this cars because on the long run this will destroy the brand.

The best marketing was when Jaguar owners were maintaining their cars 10, 15 or 20 years in pristine condition. But now it is simply not possible.